Origins: The Doctrine of The Creation (Genesis 1:1)

[Kaplok Kaplok]

Actually, the Bible can speak for itself (not literally audible) regarding its authenticity.

Anyone can speak of their own authenticity. Even liars can do that.

Real authenticity actually comes from comparing with other established truths. Like one witness testimony should match another witness', before it is deemed authentic.

 

[reformedbonhidalgo]

Bon, about what you stated here below:

"How about this:

1. Laws of physics: Fundamental laws governing the behavior of the physical universe, like the law of gravity or laws of thermodynamics.
2. Conservation of energy: Energy cannot be created or destroyed, only transformed from one form to another.

Can you say that these truths are relative?"

I agree that the laws of physics are immutable, you can't violate them. How then can God create the universe and everything in it in 6-7 days? Any scientist will tell you that billions of years have passed for us to reach our current state.

God would have violated the laws of physics if he shortened "creation" into 6-7 days, wouldn't he?


It seems that you are excluding other holy books, not to mention other belief systems that aren't book-based.

All that you stated can also be stated to you by a Muslim and basing his/her readings on the Koran, or a Hindu from the Bhagavad Gita, and so on and so forth. Would you like them to call their "truths" as the "absolute truth"? Which book has claim to the absolute truth?

Also, why do you believe in the Bible? Did it speak to you directly? Or was it interpreted by you or by a Pastor/Priest/Holy Man? Isn't it folly to rely on human interpretation? All humans are fallible (except the Pope, Catholics would say.) Shouldn't the Bible or any holy book explain itself, by itself, without passing through fallible human interpretations?

A well-known scientist named Herbert Spencer died in 1903. He discovered that all reality, all that exists in the universe can be contained in five categories: time, force, action, space, and matter. Herbert Spencer said everything that exists, exists in one of those categories: time, force, action, space, and matter.

Now think about that: time, force, action, space, and matter. That is a logical sequence. And then with that in your mind, listen to You do not have permission to view the full content of this post. Log in or register now., “In the beginning” – that’s time – “God” – that’s force – “created” – that’s action – “the heavens” – that’s space – “and the earth,” that’s matter. Everything that could be said about everything that exists is said in that first verse. Now either you believe that, or you don’t. You either believe that that verse is accurate and God is the force, or you believe that God is not the force that created everything. And then you’re left with chance or randomness or coincidence.

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[reformedbonhidalgo]

Anyone can speak of their own authenticity. Even liars can do that.

Real authenticity actually comes from comparing with other established truths. Like one witness testimony should match another witness', before it is deemed authentic.

Here's the thing, the Bible itself is the highest degree when it comes to truthfulness. It is the human who always in error. You can read history regarding the Bible and its authenticity if it is just merely written by man.

 

[Asherah Goddess]

To make it easier for you, I will give you some examples.

How about this:
​

1. Laws of physics: Fundamental laws governing the behavior of the physical universe, like the law of gravity or laws of thermodynamics.​
2. Conservation of energy: Energy cannot be created or destroyed, only transformed from one form to another.​

Can you say that these truths are relative?

The same with the Word of God, they are absolute! You can refute all you want, but it doesn't change its truthfulness regarding what it claims.

People in the past are trying to refute the truthfulness of the bible, they all died, but the Bible is still being used in the world of Christianity. You will die in 70-80 years, but the truth about God will never die with you.

What I am saying is that, the Word of God--the Bible still holds what it claims to be--it is the highest in its degree of truthfulness!

Let me ask you a question. When you die, will you spend your eternity in heaven or in hell? Can you say with full conviction that you will have eternal life fellowshipping with God of the Bible?

If not! I suggest you repent and believe in the Gospel of Christ. He is the only way to salvation for your soul!​

Huh? Pinapa-repent mo ako at gusto mo ako maniwala sa "Gospel of Christ" dahil naniniwala ka ang tangi "kaligtasan" ay sa paniniwala niyo lamang?

Ano iyon? Yung "tama" at "mabuti" paniniwala ay na sa inyo lang? Pagkatapos ako ay mapupunta sa "impierno" dahil Deist ako? Ganun?

Ano iyon? "One click of a finger" ay seconds lang na naniniwala na ako sa Gospel of Christ agad. Ganun ang gusto mo sa akin?

Hindi realistic ang sinasabi mo sa akin. Sabi mo sa akin ay ito "I beg to disagree! Your faith doesn't change the truth! It doesn't matter what you believe the truth stays absolute."

Since subjective ang "truth" for me dahil based on beliefs lang naman siya so nag-agree ako nang sinabi mo na "truth stays absolute" and since , subjectively , ang truth sa akin ay meron God pero ayaw ko ng "relihiyon".

Well, I believe in a "spiritual world" na comes from a "mental state" and not literal place of "heaven" and "hell". If ano ang pinapaniwalaan ng tao ay mag-eexist rin po sa after life. Tayo lang ang gagawa ng heavenly and hellish mental state na magrereflect sa afterlife po. Based on how people lived on earth if naninirahan ito with "heavenly life" or a "hellish life".

So if for example, one person who believes that God is wrath na taga parusa lang siya , natural na kapag namatay po ang tao , kung ano ang beliefs niya po ay mag-eexist po sa after life.

Ganyan ang concept ko about afterlife or sinasabi na heaven or hell po. Tutal , yung mental state daw na nakalagay sa biblia ay binan daw. For me ay truth po siya sapagkat nakabasa na ako ng ilan-ilan "near death experience" and "afterlife experience" ng iba-ibang relihiyon at iba-ibang kultura sa different countries po.​

 

[reformedbonhidalgo]

Huh? Pinapa-repent mo ako at gusto mo ako maniwala sa "Gospel of Christ" dahil naniniwala ka ang tangi "kaligtasan" ay sa paniniwala niyo lamang?

Ano iyon? Yung "tama" at "mabuti" paniniwala ay na sa inyo lang? Pagkatapos ako ay mapupunta sa "impierno" dahil Deist ako? Ganun?

Ano iyon? "One click of a finger" ay seconds lang na naniniwala na ako sa Gospel of Christ agad. Ganun ang gusto mo sa akin?

Hindi realistic ang sinasabi mo sa akin. Sabi mo sa akin ay ito "I beg to disagree! Your faith doesn't change the truth! It doesn't matter what you believe the truth stays absolute."

Since subjective ang "truth" for me dahil based on beliefs lang naman siya so nag-agree ako nang sinabi mo na "truth stays absolute" and since , subjectively , ang truth sa akin ay meron God pero ayaw ko ng "relihiyon".

Well, I believe in a "spiritual world" na comes from a "mental state" and not literal place of "heaven" and "hell". If ano ang pinapaniwalaan ng tao ay mag-eexist rin po sa after life. Tayo lang ang gagawa ng heavenly and hellish mental state na magrereflect sa afterlife po. Based on how people lived on earth if naninirahan ito with "heavenly life" or a "hellish life".

So if for example, one person who believes that God is wrath na taga parusa lang siya , natural na kapag namatay po ang tao , kung ano ang beliefs niya po ay mag-eexist po sa after life.

Ganyan ang concept ko about afterlife or sinasabi na heaven or hell po. Tutal , yung mental state daw na nakalagay sa biblia ay binan daw. For me ay truth po siya sapagkat nakabasa na ako ng ilan-ilan "near death experience" and "afterlife experience" ng iba-ibang relihiyon at iba-ibang kultura sa different countries po.​

You know what ma'am I pity you.

I just pray to God that He will open your eyes to see the truth! May God bless your soul.

 

[Asherah Goddess]

You know what ma'am I pity you. I just pray to God that He will open your eyes to see the truth! May God bless your soul.​

Me too. I pity you. You are a close-minded person po. I just hope na ma-enlighten ka or ma-open ang mind mo or let us say na ma-open your eyes mo in a real , real-world po. Same lang po tayong dalawa na nagkakaawaan sa bawat isa.
​

 

[N E G A N]

Sakin naman I believe in Jesus, Allah

 

[reformedbonhidalgo]

Me too. I pity you. You are a close-minded person po. I just hope na ma-enlighten ka or ma-open ang mind mo or let us say na ma-open your eyes mo in a real , real-world po. Same lang po tayong dalawa na nagkakaawaan sa bawat isa.
​

You are not living in the real-world. You are just living in your own fantasy. I hope one day you wake up.

 

[Asherah Goddess]

You are not living in the real-world. You are just living in your own fantasy. I hope one day you wake up.​

Ewan ko. Parang baligtad "ata". Para sa akin lang. So ang mga tao na "naniniwala in the bible" at "naniniwala sa religion" ay considered not fantasy pero ang mga realistic na tao na nag-outside the bible and outside religion ay tinawag mo ng "fantasy".

Hindi siya pwede tawagin "fantasy" kung open ang mind ng isang tao sa different beliefs ng different people at culture po. Real world po siya lalo na kung mga eksperto na nakapag-aral na meron kilalaman sa study of society or study of different norms po versus sa bible verse lang naka-dependent ang lahat pati ultimong literal interpretation po at dahil andoon lang naka-depend , ang tangi lamang iisipin na ang kanyang paniniwala ay iyon lamang totoo at tunay po. Pati near-death experience or afterlife experience ay iignore pati as long as wala nakalagay sa bible malamang.

Iyan ang real world. Totoong mundo na meron po tayo na hindi lamang binabasehan ang "sacred text".
​

 

[Kaplok Kaplok]

You are not living in the real-world. You are just living in your own fantasy. I hope one day you wake up.

Says the one who believes in myths.. hahaha

May gana ka pa umasta na morally superior at mang condecend ng kapwa mo dito. Tingin tingin din sa sarili.

³ “Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? ⁴How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? ⁵ You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye. -Matthew 7

 

[OrangeMoon]

Actually, the Bible can speak for itself (not literally audible) regarding its authenticity.

I disagree, all "speaking" of the Bible is via fallible humans.

For authenticity, we can also say the Muslim or Hindu holy books also speak of their own authenticity. I don't need to back that up, since you just said the Bible can also speak for its authenticity without any proof.

A well-known scientist named Herbert Spencer

He's actually more of a polymath/philosopher, not a "hard" scientist (bio and anthropology may be the closest.)

died in 1903. He discovered that all reality, all that exists in the universe can be contained in five categories: time, force, action, space, and matter. Herbert Spencer said everything that exists, exists in one of those categories: time, force, action, space, and matter.

Now think about that: time, force, action, space, and matter. That is a logical sequence.

Spencer's sequence was actually "Space, Time, Matter, Motion, and Force."
(See his book First Principles, Chapter 3, Part 2)

And then with that in your mind, listen to You do not have permission to view the full content of this post. Log in or register now., “In the beginning” – that’s time – “God” – that’s force – “created” – that’s action – “the heavens” – that’s space – “and the earth,” that’s matter.

The Bible is out of order then?
vs. "Space, Time, Matter, Motion, and Force."

“the heavens” – that’s space
“In the beginning” – that’s time
“and the earth,” that’s matter
“created” – that’s action (motion)
“God” – that’s force

So God came last?

Everything that could be said about everything that exists is said in that first verse. Now either you believe that, or you don’t.

Statements like this really confuse me, because we can just say this for anything. I can say that "Our Supreme Being is actually a Pink Dragon" (or the Flying Spaghetti Monster), then after that I say "Now either you believe that, or you don’t."

Why can't God or the Bible be something undeniable like gravity. Everyone knows and believes gravity exists without any holy book backing it, gravity "just is". I don't have to say "Now either you believe that, or you don’t." about gravity. You can just immediately test gravity out.

 

[plhbg1]

so how are we going to verify your claims boss? is there a way to check?

 

[reformedbonhidalgo]

so how are we going to verify your claims boss? is there a way to check?

Read this article you might wanna reexamine your position.

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Read this article you might wanna reexamine your position.

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It has no bias since the website is research-based.

I disagree, all "speaking" of the Bible is via fallible humans.

For authenticity, we can also say the Muslim or Hindu holy books also speak of their own authenticity. I don't need to back that up, since you just said the Bible can also speak for its authenticity without any proof.


He's actually more of a polymath/philosopher, not a "hard" scientist (bio and anthropology may be the closest.)


Spencer's sequence was actually "Space, Time, Matter, Motion, and Force."
(See his book First Principles, Chapter 3, Part 2)


The Bible is out of order then?
vs. "Space, Time, Matter, Motion, and Force."

“the heavens” – that’s space
“In the beginning” – that’s time
“and the earth,” that’s matter
“created” – that’s action (motion)
“God” – that’s force

So God came last?


Statements like this really confuse me, because we can just say this for anything. I can say that "Our Supreme Being is actually a Pink Dragon" (or the Flying Spaghetti Monster), then after that I say "Now either you believe that, or you don’t."

Why can't God or the Bible be something undeniable like gravity. Everyone knows and believes gravity exists without any holy book backing it, gravity "just is". I don't have to say "Now either you believe that, or you don’t." about gravity. You can just immediately test gravity out.

Did your pink dragon ever create something that is visible now? Can you convey that to all people? Does it hold the truthfulness to what it claims?

Says the one who believes in myths.. hahaha

May gana ka pa umasta na morally superior at mang condecend ng kapwa mo dito. Tingin tingin din sa sarili.

³ “Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? ⁴How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? ⁵ You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye. -Matthew 7

Why do you quote from the bible if you don't believe in it?

 

[OrangeMoon]

Did your pink dragon ever create something that is visible now? Can you convey that to all people? Does it hold the truthfulness to what it claims?

Bon, this question can also be easily asked of you:
Did your God ever create something that is visible now? (Except things that happen naturally)

Can you convey that to all people? (Proof that everyne can accept?, like the existence of gravity)

Does it hold the truthfulness to what it claims? (Again, how about the Muslim or Hindu truths? Are they all lying then?)

 

[The Owner]

God is the Creator, and Science is the study of God's creation. It's sufficient for an intelligent human to comprehend.

 

[plhbg1]

Read this article you might wanna reexamine your position.

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this proves that such a religion/belief existed but not prove that god existed haha

 

[reformedbonhidalgo]

Bon, this question can also be easily asked of you:
Did your God ever create something that is visible now? (Except things that happen naturally)

Can you convey that to all people? (Proof that everyne can accept?, like the existence of gravity)

Does it hold the truthfulness to what it claims? (Again, how about the Muslim or Hindu truths? Are they all lying then?)

How do you explain "The Happen Naturally?"

Can something exist from nothing?

If I give you a book can you say that it just happen to be there without someone is making it?

Can you trace back everything where it came from?
Can you make your defense in 2000 words article stating that everything came from just a random without someone making them. They just happen "naturally."

this proves that such a religion/belief existed but not prove that god existed haha

The same goes for you. Can you make a 2000-word article stating your defense that everything came from nothing, and they just happen naturally without a maker.

Does it hold the truthfulness to what it claims? (Again, how about the Muslim or Hindu truths? Are they all lying then?)

They are deceived. Muslims, and other religions are deceived. I know it's hard to swallow but that's the truth. All religions that are based on "works salvation" are deceived, period.

 

[plhbg1]

The same goes for you. Can you make a 2000-word article stating your defense that everything came from nothing, and they just happen naturally without a maker.

ahaha actually boss i don't claim that every thing came from nothing, i claim that it is rather unknown at the moment hehe

 

[reformedbonhidalgo]

ahaha actually boss i don't claim that every thing came from nothing, i claim that it is rather unknown at the moment hehe

It's the same, if you can't define your unknown, you can't even defend the analogy of the book.

ahaha actually boss i don't claim that every thing came from nothing, i claim that it is rather unknown at the moment hehe

May I invite you to a formal debate?

0926 146 4676

or contact me at facebook

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Gusto mo facebook live?

Your position whatever it is..

 

[plhbg1]

It's the same, if you can't define your unknown, you can't even defend the analogy of the book.

the unknown is clearly defined boss: the origin of the universe, i don't have a book to defend as well, unlike you na merong book to defend: bible

May I invite you to a formal debate?

0926 146 4676

or contact me at facebook

You do not have permission to view the full content of this post. Log in or register now.

Gusto mo facebook live?

Your position whatever it is..

bakit anung problema sa PHC as a debate platform boss? haha