Is God real?

[jayendecastro]

That's the point our physical world is complex and precisely tune. It is impossible that is was made by accident. Even we calculate the odds, the numbers is impossibility.

Its complex, sure....but how do u know its precisely tuned?

 

[Thespian]

The point of the argument is deductive. What's best explain reality. Can the atheism framework explain the "Why" question? Can naturalism explain the complexity of the universe? Can nothing produce something?

"The point of the argument is deductive."
There is nothing deductive with any of your statement. All you did was claim that your personal god created everything since wristwatch has a creator because your holly book says so and disregard the idea that you're god needs to have a far higher creator since any complex entity needs a creator to be made so is god because well paradox.

"What's best explain reality"
I don't know but at least I know that your personal god is the very opposite of it.

"Can the atheism framework explain the "Why" question?"
No and why should I? Atheism was there because people make big claims that they cannot provide any verifiable proof. Only people who thinks that they are somehow special will ask this question because they want to glorify their existence.

"Can naturalism explain the complexity of the universe? Can nothing produce something?"
It might be the bigbang or something that exist before the bigbang and a series of random events form billions and biliions of years might be the reason why there is a universe. Universe might be a byproduct of something that exist in the beginning of time but that something does not need to be your god or any other god. It doesn't needs to be sentient. It doesn't need to care for you. It doesn't need to watch you as you masterbate.

 

[GildartsTale]

"The point of the argument is deductive."
There is nothing deductive with any of your statement. All you did was claim that your personal god created everything since wristwatch has a creator because your holly book says so and disregard the idea that you're god needs to have a far higher creator since any complex entity needs a creator to be made so is god because well paradox.

"What's best explain reality"
I don't know but at least I know that your personal god is the very opposite of it.

"Can the atheism framework explain the "Why" question?"
No and why should I? Atheism was there because people make big claims that they cannot provide any verifiable proof. Only people who thinks that they are somehow special will ask this question because they want to glorify their existence.

"Can naturalism explain the complexity of the universe? Can nothing produce something?"
It might be the bigbang or something that exist before the bigbang and a series of random events form billions and biliions of years might be the reason why there is a universe. Universe might be a byproduct of something that exist in the beginning of time but that something does not need to be your god or any other god. It doesn't needs to be sentient. It doesn't need to care for you. It doesn't need to watch you as you masterbate.

Its complex, sure....but how do u know its precisely tuned?

https://phcorner.net/threads/fine-tuning-of-the-universe.1132094/

 

[GildartsTale]

hmmmm.. thats blind faith. Our faith is grounded by empirical truths, historical evidence, what's best explain reality.

 

[TitaKrissy]

I just leave it here.
"Ako ang Alpha at ang Omega. Ang simula at ang wakas." Rev. 22:13 so basically no one created God kasi sya ang simula ng lahat. Correct me if I'm wrong nalang. Lots of love love. God is good

 

[Thespian]

Let's not go over from one argument from ignorance to another one. Were on this thread so stick to it. You might as well answer the comments that you quoted.

 

[jayendecastro]

https://phcorner.net/threads/fine-tuning-of-the-universe.1132094/

Just how long did it take for your god to "fine-tune" evrything??

 

[JackFrost10]

its a cyclical, post hoc, special pleading argument, a creation needs a creator therefore your god exist.

a creation needs a creator (the watch and the watchmaker), where did the watchmaker come from?, came from god(post hoc), where did god come from?, god is god (special pleading), how did you know?, the bible(cyclical) where did the bible came from?, god.

the bible cannot be proven or disproven ergo its faith based.

The fine tuning argument is also a post hoc to the creation argument, if you question the fine tuning argument, you'll eventually end up to the answer "god works in mysterious ways".

a post hoc followed by special pleading is a sure way to win an argument to those who are uninitiated to logical fallacies.

 

[GildartsTale]

Then tell me, "why does our physical world , the universe or our earth is finely tune?" For me, it is more illogical to believe that this fine tuning its just by product of accident.

Let me give this to you. If I give you "nothing" plus another "nothing" would that nothing produce something after a billion years?

 

[GildartsTale]

God is not bound by time and space so you question is?

In our worldview, there are two answers to "how long". Old Earther or Creationism.

 

[GildartsTale]

[XX='crimepoet, c: 1393020, m: 1799670'][/XX]

How do you know that my argument is from ignorance?

If its the Bigbang? What cause the Bigbang to occur in the first place?

Can nothing produce something after a billion or trillion years? Really?

p.s. the OP was just a summary of the said argument it needed another thread, since no one would read it, if it was too long.

 

[Thespian]

[XX='GildartsTale, c: 1398444, m: 1782240'][/XX]

How do you know that my argument is from ignorance?

You claim that because the universe is complex, god must have created it and not only that, you also claim that it was your personal god who created it among the thousands of gods since a watch cannot be created if there is no watchmaker. Just because you do not know how the universe and life came into existence does not mean that you can just claim that it was created by your god- thus argument from ignorance. If there is a tiny bit of intellectual honesty in you at least admit that you know nothing same as I do.

I might as well remind you that you commit special pleading which I pointed out since the beginning. At least sink the meaning of these two in your head and try to understand them.

If its the Bigbang? What cause the Bigbang to occur in the first place?

I don't know but just because I don't know it means that it is your god.

Can nothing produce something after a billion or trillion years? Really?

"It might be the bigbang or something that exist before the bigbang and a series of random events form billions and biliions of years might be the reason why there is a universe. Universe might be a byproduct of something that exist in the beginning of time but that something does not need to be your god or any other god. It doesn't needs to be sentient. It doesn't need to care for you. It doesn't need to watch you as you masterbate."

Just where on this statement or any comment on this thread do I say something like that? Please practice proper reading comprehension. You can have all the time in the universe that you want.

 

[GildartsTale]

"Can naturalism explain the complexity of the universe? Can nothing produce something?"

"It might be the bigbang or something that exist before the bigbang and a series of random events form billions and biliions of years might be the reason why there is a universe. Universe might be a byproduct of something that exist in the beginning of time but that something does not need to be your god or any other god. It doesn't needs to be sentient. It doesn't need to care for you. It doesn't need to watch you as you masterbate."

My question above? your answer below. tsk2.. Reading comprehension.

You claim that because the universe is complex, god must have created it and not only that, you also claim that it was your personal god who created it among the thousands of gods since a watch cannot be created if there is no watchmaker. Just because you do not know how the universe and life came into existence does not mean that you can just claim that it was created by your god- thus argument from ignorance. If there is a tiny bit of intellectual honesty in you at least admit that you know nothing same as I do.

It is because believing that God created it is more probable than believing this fine-tuned universe just a by product of accident or nothing. Again, its just a summery of the whole argument you just can't make conclusion without understanding the whole.

I don't know but just because I don't know it means that it is your god.

That's the point. That is why I am giving an argument that theist can give an answer to the "i dont know".

 

[JackFrost10]

Then tell me, "why does our physical world , the universe or our earth is finely tune?" For me, it is more illogical to believe that this fine tuning its just by product of accident.

its not, we cant breath under water, earth is 71% water its like buying a house and most of it is flooded. Imagine pitching a house like that, "its a finely tuned house for you and your family to live in, just ignore the flooding". that's just on top of my head.

Let me give this to you. If I give you "nothing" plus another "nothing" would that nothing produce something after a billion years?

yes,

 

[Thespian]

"It might be the bigbang or something that exist before the bigbang and a series of random events form billions and biliions of years might be the reason why there is a universe. Universe might be a byproduct of something that exist in the beginning of time but that something does not need to be your god or any other god. It doesn't needs to be sentient. It doesn't need to care for you. It doesn't need to watch you as you masterbate."

For the nth time please practice proper reading comprehension.

It is because believing that God created it is more probable than believing this fine-tuned universe just a by product of accident or nothing. Again, its just a summery of the whole argument you just can't make conclusion without understanding the whole.

No it's not specially when you claim that it was your personal god who did it without any proof or evidence. In the fist place, the universe was never fine tuned for any of us. The majority of the universe was there to kill you not only that, you can only use 1/4 of the earth's surface to live, the remaining 3/4 consist of water that wasn't even drinkable. You are just a prisoner on this insignificant pale blue dot of a planet. Even if that pale blue planet is gone (and that will surely happen in the future), the universe will not care.

That's the point. That is why I am giving an argument that theist can give an answer to the "i dont know".

Not it's not. It's just a claim composed of especial pleading fallacy and argument from ignorance used as a placeholder to the questions you cannot answer as of now so that you will think no more.